天賦是甚麼? - NBA

By Barb Cronin
at 2016-11-17T00:04
at 2016-11-17T00:04
Table of Contents
我上篇被結案了,剛要回才知道原來被S 了不應該回。寫好
了就貼,我主要想講的是後半,可是講得很爛,有耐心的版
友加減看。
----------------------------------------------------
我在上一篇從頭到尾都沒有否定過Kobe勤奮苦練的精神,我
也很肯定Kobe的過人天賦,我更沒有否定Kobe的偉大成就,
換句話說,我要表達的是Kobe把他的天賦很徹底地壓榨轉化
成實績。
通常甚麼時候講天賦?選秀、新人、有些哀傷的浪費滿滿天
賦的警世故事。
通常甚麼時候講苦練?球星小故事、回顧球星生涯、球員有
好表現時補充的錦上添花。
以上我一定有漏列,不過在比較文中,大概很難看到把天賦
跟苦練拿出來講,都是拿實績出來比,尤其是比較退役球星
,成績都擺在那邊,講天賦跟苦練幹嗎?
天賦100 、苦練100 ,實績80,就是輸給實績90的,管他這
個人天賦跟苦練拿幾分。
頂多是談到一些天賦條件有明顯低於水平的,例如Nash的身
體對抗性、AI的身高,會想像一下Nash如果壯一點、AI如果
高一點,成就或許會更高的感嘆。
原POe04su3的文被刪了,他的文就是簡單講幾項T 妹>Kobe,
然後下結論把T妹講成實力更強卻運氣不好,就是比較文,比
的還是兩個曾稱霸當代位置的退役球星。
你有看過TD、KG、老馬、Dirk幾個在互比的比較文中,意見相
左的兩派在那邊一直講天賦跟苦練嗎?
明明經歷過Kobe跟T 妹全盛期的球迷不用問古狗也知道兩個人
的生涯成就差距頗大,看了e04su3的文要不一笑置之,要不隨
便列幾個數據就能打他臉,卻有好幾個版友在推文提天賦跟苦
練,你的目的是想說明或反駁甚麼?
你如果在回顧Kobe生涯、再分享Kobe小故事、在討論職業態度
裡,把Kobe苦練拿出來講,OK啊,我不會吐槽,只是這種球星
自律並苦練的文章一大堆,我連舉例都懶得舉,甚至有很多很
努力才打進輪替的邊緣替補也都有刻苦練習的故事,就看你關
不關注而已。
所以,在我上一篇文底下還一直強調Kobe苦練是球星球員認證
過的版友,明白我要說的了嗎?
一、你在比較文底下提天賦跟苦練,參考價值0。
二、苦練的一大堆,沒有天賦根本打不到Kobe的程度。
三、Kobe跟T 妹的天賦都爆表,才能一時引領風騷,孰優孰劣
不要只下T妹史詩級這種沒頭沒尾的結論,你具體講T妹史詩在
哪看看。
最後,既然多數看球超過10年資歷的版友應該都明知Kobe跟 T
妹的生涯成就差距,你又要講天賦輸T 妹,又要強調Kobe苦練
,其實,你是想講下面這句話吧:
Kobe天賦輸,可是苦練,所以成就贏T妹。
這就叫做吹捧。
------------------------------------------------------
講天賦,昨天回文時喝多,e04su3的文又被刪了,我忘了他的
文跟推文裡具體是用哪個詞。
我就先說是"先天條件",姑且不負責任定義成老北老木給的DNA
跟拉拔長大以後的樣子。
最簡單無爭議的就是身材,身高、體重、臂長,具體的數字。
再來是體能,應該比較無爭議的是爆發力、速度、跳高、對抗
性,只要看過比賽,大概可以形成群體的共識某某某就是第一
步快、運球推進快、跳得高,這些也可以轉化成具體數字作比
較。
我上篇文內有版友提到DAJ跟TD比,大概就是就身材跟以上的體
能定義作比較。
體能,應該不止於此,所有純生理機能,不牽扯腦袋的應該都要
包含進去,肌肉強度、柔軟度、協調性、身體延展性....我沒辦
法全列出來,我認為手感也應該算體能的一種,像是TP拋投的準
度除了勤奮練習之外,主要是奠基在他的極佳手感之上。
這部分到底該放進多少東西,大概就有爭議了。
最後一樣,跟腦袋有關係的,就把它稱之為"天賦"吧。教育部重
編字典的解釋:天生的才能,自然的稟賦。
很籠統。
奇摩字典這個解釋不錯:先天上,對某些特定事物的敏感度、領
悟力、學習能力特別強,能輕易地比他人學得又快又好。
常看板上有人講"球商",我理解成:對戰術的洞悉及執行能力,
能因應對手防守適當地作出應對。
但這個理解只偏進攻。
所以我又改理解成:能觀察場上現況預測出接下來的動態,並作
出正確的應對。
這部份我停住不寫了,背景知識不夠,寫不出完整且觀念正確的
東西來。
我只是想說,任何能常態性演出讓你讚嘆再三的漂亮play的球員
,絕對都是先有充足適當的先天條件,然後不斷練習,再透過實
戰累積經驗,成就出來的結果。
例如講到助攻,很多人會講傳球視野,我也常講,Manu的雷射肩
傳球很唬爛帥到掉渣,要模仿他,只需要Manu那超群的傳球視野
就夠了嗎?不,看得到,還要有Manu的臂力跟腕力才能把球傳得
又直又快,不然Manu上十大好球,傳慢了是中途被攔截被教練換
下場痛罵一頓。
臂力跟腕力可以透過後天練習,大隻男很多,超越Manu也不見得
難如登天,只是還要有Manu的協調性,才能把力道灌進球裡傳得
又直又快,更重要的,還傳得準,接球者一接就起,命中率才高
,才有機會上十大,不然沒傳準,接球者多花0.1 秒拉回來,防
守者多撲出去1 呎,命中率下降,只能撿籃板。
防守端也不是努力跟苦練就能成就一切的,身材標準、體能不賴
、球商很高,在進攻端變向換檔假動作一堆就是能搞進藍,可是
防守破爛的球員一直不缺;反過來,像馬刺小綠那種進攻爛唯有
苦練出的一投的大鎖也一直都有,我不認為這僅僅只是防守技術
及態度的問題,進攻是主動出招給人接,防守是被動別人出招你
應對,角色的不同,點到的天賦點數就不見得通用。
TD後期的跳一塊豆腐高蓋鍋技術,看了20幾年,好像也只有TD練出
來而已,TD身材好、體能也好,球商也高,他的點數在攻守兩端都
幾乎點滿,所以一入行就年度隊伍年度防守隊伍連霸,他累積大量
實戰經驗後,對場上動態的判斷速度更是快到不可思議,居然足夠
彌補他的速度退化,就是能先佔住位置,利用他的身材跟長臂等對
手切進來送死。
而這平凡的神乎其技真要講,除了TD的身材跟天賦之外,也跟TD的
嚴格自律減重、從事其他運動來盈持保泰有關係。
運動任何一個細節都跟先天條件掛得上關係,但要靠先天條件就成
為頂尖,基本上我是不信的,大歐就是愛唬爛自己天生神力,他的
不夠自律或許是造成他生涯後期快速下滑的原因,他的轟炸籃框也
還可以講是天賦,但是他的小鉤射跟破包夾的傳球能力,沒有下過
苦功就練得出來我打死不信。
先天條件就決定了上限,練習很辛苦,持續進步讓我們從事運動有
突破天際的爽快,產生自己衝破上限的假象,但就某個角度看,再
怎麼苦練,就是接近上限而已,並不是突破上限。
極端講,意志力、抗壓力、專注力等等這些被認為是後天可以補足
、可以練習、培養、訓練的東西,其實也被先天決定了上限,所以
AI的鬥魂、MJ對贏的瘋狂執念、TD預約史上第一四號後還苦苦追逐
冠軍7 年,這些東西都不是想學就學得來的。
--
了就貼,我主要想講的是後半,可是講得很爛,有耐心的版
友加減看。
----------------------------------------------------
我在上一篇從頭到尾都沒有否定過Kobe勤奮苦練的精神,我
也很肯定Kobe的過人天賦,我更沒有否定Kobe的偉大成就,
換句話說,我要表達的是Kobe把他的天賦很徹底地壓榨轉化
成實績。
通常甚麼時候講天賦?選秀、新人、有些哀傷的浪費滿滿天
賦的警世故事。
通常甚麼時候講苦練?球星小故事、回顧球星生涯、球員有
好表現時補充的錦上添花。
以上我一定有漏列,不過在比較文中,大概很難看到把天賦
跟苦練拿出來講,都是拿實績出來比,尤其是比較退役球星
,成績都擺在那邊,講天賦跟苦練幹嗎?
天賦100 、苦練100 ,實績80,就是輸給實績90的,管他這
個人天賦跟苦練拿幾分。
頂多是談到一些天賦條件有明顯低於水平的,例如Nash的身
體對抗性、AI的身高,會想像一下Nash如果壯一點、AI如果
高一點,成就或許會更高的感嘆。
原POe04su3的文被刪了,他的文就是簡單講幾項T 妹>Kobe,
然後下結論把T妹講成實力更強卻運氣不好,就是比較文,比
的還是兩個曾稱霸當代位置的退役球星。
你有看過TD、KG、老馬、Dirk幾個在互比的比較文中,意見相
左的兩派在那邊一直講天賦跟苦練嗎?
明明經歷過Kobe跟T 妹全盛期的球迷不用問古狗也知道兩個人
的生涯成就差距頗大,看了e04su3的文要不一笑置之,要不隨
便列幾個數據就能打他臉,卻有好幾個版友在推文提天賦跟苦
練,你的目的是想說明或反駁甚麼?
你如果在回顧Kobe生涯、再分享Kobe小故事、在討論職業態度
裡,把Kobe苦練拿出來講,OK啊,我不會吐槽,只是這種球星
自律並苦練的文章一大堆,我連舉例都懶得舉,甚至有很多很
努力才打進輪替的邊緣替補也都有刻苦練習的故事,就看你關
不關注而已。
所以,在我上一篇文底下還一直強調Kobe苦練是球星球員認證
過的版友,明白我要說的了嗎?
一、你在比較文底下提天賦跟苦練,參考價值0。
二、苦練的一大堆,沒有天賦根本打不到Kobe的程度。
三、Kobe跟T 妹的天賦都爆表,才能一時引領風騷,孰優孰劣
不要只下T妹史詩級這種沒頭沒尾的結論,你具體講T妹史詩在
哪看看。
最後,既然多數看球超過10年資歷的版友應該都明知Kobe跟 T
妹的生涯成就差距,你又要講天賦輸T 妹,又要強調Kobe苦練
,其實,你是想講下面這句話吧:
Kobe天賦輸,可是苦練,所以成就贏T妹。
這就叫做吹捧。
------------------------------------------------------
講天賦,昨天回文時喝多,e04su3的文又被刪了,我忘了他的
文跟推文裡具體是用哪個詞。
我就先說是"先天條件",姑且不負責任定義成老北老木給的DNA
跟拉拔長大以後的樣子。
最簡單無爭議的就是身材,身高、體重、臂長,具體的數字。
再來是體能,應該比較無爭議的是爆發力、速度、跳高、對抗
性,只要看過比賽,大概可以形成群體的共識某某某就是第一
步快、運球推進快、跳得高,這些也可以轉化成具體數字作比
較。
我上篇文內有版友提到DAJ跟TD比,大概就是就身材跟以上的體
能定義作比較。
體能,應該不止於此,所有純生理機能,不牽扯腦袋的應該都要
包含進去,肌肉強度、柔軟度、協調性、身體延展性....我沒辦
法全列出來,我認為手感也應該算體能的一種,像是TP拋投的準
度除了勤奮練習之外,主要是奠基在他的極佳手感之上。
這部分到底該放進多少東西,大概就有爭議了。
最後一樣,跟腦袋有關係的,就把它稱之為"天賦"吧。教育部重
編字典的解釋:天生的才能,自然的稟賦。
很籠統。
奇摩字典這個解釋不錯:先天上,對某些特定事物的敏感度、領
悟力、學習能力特別強,能輕易地比他人學得又快又好。
常看板上有人講"球商",我理解成:對戰術的洞悉及執行能力,
能因應對手防守適當地作出應對。
但這個理解只偏進攻。
所以我又改理解成:能觀察場上現況預測出接下來的動態,並作
出正確的應對。
這部份我停住不寫了,背景知識不夠,寫不出完整且觀念正確的
東西來。
我只是想說,任何能常態性演出讓你讚嘆再三的漂亮play的球員
,絕對都是先有充足適當的先天條件,然後不斷練習,再透過實
戰累積經驗,成就出來的結果。
例如講到助攻,很多人會講傳球視野,我也常講,Manu的雷射肩
傳球很唬爛帥到掉渣,要模仿他,只需要Manu那超群的傳球視野
就夠了嗎?不,看得到,還要有Manu的臂力跟腕力才能把球傳得
又直又快,不然Manu上十大好球,傳慢了是中途被攔截被教練換
下場痛罵一頓。
臂力跟腕力可以透過後天練習,大隻男很多,超越Manu也不見得
難如登天,只是還要有Manu的協調性,才能把力道灌進球裡傳得
又直又快,更重要的,還傳得準,接球者一接就起,命中率才高
,才有機會上十大,不然沒傳準,接球者多花0.1 秒拉回來,防
守者多撲出去1 呎,命中率下降,只能撿籃板。
防守端也不是努力跟苦練就能成就一切的,身材標準、體能不賴
、球商很高,在進攻端變向換檔假動作一堆就是能搞進藍,可是
防守破爛的球員一直不缺;反過來,像馬刺小綠那種進攻爛唯有
苦練出的一投的大鎖也一直都有,我不認為這僅僅只是防守技術
及態度的問題,進攻是主動出招給人接,防守是被動別人出招你
應對,角色的不同,點到的天賦點數就不見得通用。
TD後期的跳一塊豆腐高蓋鍋技術,看了20幾年,好像也只有TD練出
來而已,TD身材好、體能也好,球商也高,他的點數在攻守兩端都
幾乎點滿,所以一入行就年度隊伍年度防守隊伍連霸,他累積大量
實戰經驗後,對場上動態的判斷速度更是快到不可思議,居然足夠
彌補他的速度退化,就是能先佔住位置,利用他的身材跟長臂等對
手切進來送死。
而這平凡的神乎其技真要講,除了TD的身材跟天賦之外,也跟TD的
嚴格自律減重、從事其他運動來盈持保泰有關係。
運動任何一個細節都跟先天條件掛得上關係,但要靠先天條件就成
為頂尖,基本上我是不信的,大歐就是愛唬爛自己天生神力,他的
不夠自律或許是造成他生涯後期快速下滑的原因,他的轟炸籃框也
還可以講是天賦,但是他的小鉤射跟破包夾的傳球能力,沒有下過
苦功就練得出來我打死不信。
先天條件就決定了上限,練習很辛苦,持續進步讓我們從事運動有
突破天際的爽快,產生自己衝破上限的假象,但就某個角度看,再
怎麼苦練,就是接近上限而已,並不是突破上限。
極端講,意志力、抗壓力、專注力等等這些被認為是後天可以補足
、可以練習、培養、訓練的東西,其實也被先天決定了上限,所以
AI的鬥魂、MJ對贏的瘋狂執念、TD預約史上第一四號後還苦苦追逐
冠軍7 年,這些東西都不是想學就學得來的。
--
Tags:
NBA
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By Ida
at 2016-12-11T15:07
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By Ina
at 2016-12-21T02:03
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By George
at 2016-12-21T13:52
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By James
at 2016-12-26T03:57
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By Candice
at 2016-12-30T19:30
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at 2017-01-02T13:22
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at 2017-05-24T11:55
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at 2017-05-27T18:30
at 2017-05-27T18:30

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at 2017-05-31T15:55
at 2017-05-31T15:55

By Noah
at 2017-06-05T12:04
at 2017-06-05T12:04

By Vanessa
at 2017-06-09T23:31
at 2017-06-09T23:31

By Kumar
at 2017-06-10T21:55
at 2017-06-10T21:55

By Kama
at 2017-06-11T19:47
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at 2017-06-15T01:37
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By Jacky
at 2017-06-16T05:27
at 2017-06-16T05:27

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at 2017-06-20T14:50
at 2017-06-20T14:50

By Brianna
at 2017-06-24T18:12
at 2017-06-24T18:12

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at 2017-06-28T01:14
at 2017-06-28T01:14

By Carol
at 2017-06-29T22:41
at 2017-06-29T22:41

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at 2017-07-02T08:07
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By Eden
at 2017-07-04T11:04
at 2017-07-04T11:04

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at 2017-07-04T17:34
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at 2017-07-09T15:54
at 2017-07-09T15:54

By Jacob
at 2017-07-13T12:02
at 2017-07-13T12:02

By Jessica
at 2017-07-16T09:47
at 2017-07-16T09:47

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at 2017-07-20T09:33
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at 2017-07-24T07:47
at 2017-07-24T07:47

By Daniel
at 2017-07-24T11:45
at 2017-07-24T11:45

By Connor
at 2017-07-28T13:01
at 2017-07-28T13:01

By Caroline
at 2017-07-29T20:09
at 2017-07-29T20:09

By Lucy
at 2017-08-02T13:14
at 2017-08-02T13:14

By Yuri
at 2017-08-06T23:27
at 2017-08-06T23:27

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at 2017-08-07T02:24
at 2017-08-07T02:24

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at 2017-08-09T16:41
at 2017-08-09T16:41

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at 2017-08-14T13:51
at 2017-08-14T13:51

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at 2017-08-17T03:27
at 2017-08-17T03:27

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at 2017-08-18T11:37
at 2017-08-18T11:37

By Carol
at 2017-08-21T00:40
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at 2017-08-22T07:44

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at 2017-09-03T13:34
at 2017-09-03T13:34

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at 2017-09-11T14:29

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at 2017-09-16T01:00
at 2017-09-16T01:00

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at 2017-09-17T23:25
at 2017-09-17T23:25

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at 2017-09-21T09:39
at 2017-09-21T09:39

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at 2017-09-25T20:27
at 2017-09-25T20:27

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at 2017-09-28T22:39
at 2017-09-28T22:39

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at 2017-10-02T03:50
at 2017-10-02T03:50

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at 2017-10-04T14:06
at 2017-10-04T14:06

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at 2017-10-06T16:46

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at 2017-12-21T09:01
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at 2017-12-24T18:34

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at 2017-12-29T15:59
at 2017-12-29T15:59

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at 2017-12-29T19:39
at 2017-12-29T19:39

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at 2018-01-01T23:18
at 2018-01-01T23:18

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at 2018-01-03T07:22
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at 2018-01-04T10:03
at 2018-01-04T10:03

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at 2018-01-04T19:14
at 2018-01-04T19:14

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at 2018-01-08T11:18
at 2018-01-08T11:18

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at 2018-01-10T17:23
at 2018-01-10T17:23

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at 2018-01-10T22:53
at 2018-01-10T22:53

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at 2018-01-15T00:09
at 2018-01-15T00:09

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at 2018-01-17T22:36
at 2018-01-17T22:36

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at 2018-01-18T17:11
at 2018-01-18T17:11

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at 2018-01-19T21:50
at 2018-01-19T21:50

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at 2018-01-22T23:53
at 2018-01-22T23:53

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at 2018-01-23T08:56
at 2018-01-23T08:56

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at 2018-01-24T10:56
at 2018-01-24T10:56

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at 2018-01-29T10:03
at 2018-01-29T10:03

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at 2018-02-02T04:34
at 2018-02-02T04:34

By Jake
at 2018-02-05T10:49
at 2018-02-05T10:49

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at 2018-02-09T12:49
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at 2018-02-10T10:59
at 2018-02-10T10:59

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at 2018-02-10T23:49
at 2018-02-10T23:49

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at 2018-02-15T17:13
at 2018-02-15T17:13

By Hedda
at 2018-02-20T10:38
at 2018-02-20T10:38

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at 2018-02-26T16:45
at 2018-02-26T16:45

By Hedwig
at 2018-03-01T19:51
at 2018-03-01T19:51

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at 2018-03-05T12:20

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at 2018-04-13T15:30

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at 2018-04-16T10:36

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at 2018-04-19T01:53

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at 2018-04-23T00:50

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at 2018-04-25T06:07

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